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Author Topic: Ships upgrade  (Read 13305 times)
Prez
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« on: September 18, 2008, 03:20:44 pm »

What about a little upgrade for the ships strent?
IE : A planet start producing 5 light ships a turn, upgrading it will produce 8 ships , 11 and so on ......at 20 the planet will produce 5 medium ships (stronghest)  and so on.......up to 4 kind of ships light medium heavy and hard ships

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Chris
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« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2008, 08:08:31 am »

Wouldn't that have basically the same effect (i.e. a more powerful fleet) as simply increasing the quantity of production? With the exception that you wouldn't be able to split 5 medium ships into 20 different convoys, but that's hardly a major difference.

If it helps, just think of the "ship count" as representing an aggregate level of the fleet's strength. Smiley  At an abstract level, the game isn't so much about moving ships around as it is about moving strength around...
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Prez
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« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2008, 09:16:11 am »

I think that ONE medium ship will be stronger than 5 light ship (yes one medium cannot be split but this will be a strategy choise).....
Otherwise make a planet upgrade like this: starting by 5 thr first X (5?) upgrade will be 3 points so 5 will become 8 - 11 . 14 - 17 - 20 .....once starting  by 20 the upgrade will be of 5 points becoming 25 - 30 and so on, the strategy will change a bit...

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Chris
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« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2008, 10:28:32 am »

Not a bad idea. I'll think about it.
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Darkreaver1980
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« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2009, 08:52:27 pm »

Hello,

i also think that ship upgrades are heavly needed...how about a simple "Turn ships in" interface...where you can exchange your ships into stronger ones...like medium (5), heavy(12), super heavy (25) or cruisers, battleships etc. For me, it would make the game way better, cos there will be situations like: "Oh xxxx, 10 battlecruisers heading towards me!" Or make it so that planets can be upgraded differently, like producing fighters (the ones we currently use) than cruisers, battleships...so it would be like 10 fighters or 2 cruisers or 1 battleships. If the planet has only small capcity than make it so that battleships will take more turns to finish one.

you cant split the more powerfull ships, this would also mean that there should be an advantage...i would say, make it slightly stronger than the equal fighter amount...like one medium sized ship (costs 5 fighter) will be as strong as 6 fighters etc.

You could even make it so that the bigger ships will be slower than fighters = more strategic options Wink

Btw english isnt my native language Smiley
« Last Edit: January 23, 2009, 08:54:03 pm by Darkreaver1980 » Logged
Chris
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« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2009, 02:59:05 am »

Yes, this would also be a good way to approach it, especially the idea of making bigger ships slower. Thanks for sharing your ideas.

Your English is good too, I wouldn't have known it wasn't your native language if you hadn't mentioned it! Smiley

Several people have asked for multiple ship types in the past. I'm not totally opposed to it from a game design perspective (although there is an argument that it's unnecessary). The main reason that I don't see this happening is because it challenges some of the core assumptions made by the code and the interface design.

For example, how does sending ships work if you have multiple ship types at a planet? You would need to be able to select and move ship types separately. This requires:

* The code to be modified to keep track of and display multiple ship icons at each planet, which is certainly possible but would be a fair amount of work.
* It would multiply the number of art assets required; now I'd need not one ship icon per player colour, but 3-5 or more, which is not comfortably within my budget.
* It's also quite different from the current ship sending controls, where you select the planet. Again, this is surmountable, but these are not the worst problems.

How would rally points work with multiple ship types? For a complete solution, you would need to be able to specify the number of ships to leave behind on a per-type basis. For example "leave 10 fighters and 1 battleship here". But this is inflexible since it will never keep cruisers behind unless you change the settings; so you can't substitute 2 cruisers for your 1 battleship without fiddling with the settings. The entire rationale for rally points is to reduce the amount of micromanagement (fiddling) that you have to do. There are alternative designs, like just telling the computer how much "strength" to leave behind (where fighters have strength 1, a cruiser has strength 5 or whatever, etc.) and then either hard-coding a preference for leaving behind "big" ships or "small" ships or alternatively have a setting on each planet so the player can choose.

You'd need a more complicated interface for upgrading planets. All the statistics and achievements based around "destroying ships" and "losing ships" would have to be re-thought. The "total ship count" indicator would need either scrapping or heavily revising. Almost every single piece of the in-game interface would need changing in one way or another, whether it's displaying numbers of ships or letting you send ships or set rally points or upgrade planets. It would be a huge change.

Every little behaviour change required would cause significant chunks of code to need rewriting, and completely new interface design. Good UI design takes time and requires additional art. Art is one of my weak points and takes me ages to sort out. It took a couple of months and some significant expenses just to get the new achievement icons done, and they were done by a contractor and didn't have much effect on the in-game interface (unlike art for UI design would). If I'd done them myself it would been cheaper but have taken much longer and the results would be heavily inferior. I'm no artist.

Add that to the other commitments in my life (university, work, etc.) and I estimate that this would take me more than a year of my life. This is more than a year that I wouldn't be spending on fixing bugs, making other improvements to the game, doing business and marketing-related activities to increase the exposure of the game and breathe some more life into the multiplayer scene, and making additional games. In fact I'm sure it would introduce a ton of additional bugs, some of which I would fix during the year but others which would linger through multiple successive versions. And I'd probably have to spend a lot of money and/or attention on getting new art done. All up we might be looking at 2 years before all of the changes were final and mostly bug-free.

All this effort and all these problems to overcome, and the only two fundamental changes to the game would be:

* The addition of a few more strategic options
* An interface which is incredibly more complex and thus difficult to comprehend and use

I think Mayhem Intergalactic is strategic enough as it is, and I prefer my user interfaces to be nice and simple. Smiley So as you can see, I consider the benefits to be tiny compared to the enormous cost (for me, and indirectly for everyone else) of implementing such changes. Therefore I hope you understand why I won't be doing this.

Apologies for the really long explanation!

It is a good game design idea. It's just unfortunate that it's weighed down by so many issues of practicality.
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Prez
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« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2009, 11:17:48 am »




Introducing the "Group" of Starship......you cannot split the "group" (ie: 5 -BB- Battleship  3 -CR- Cruiser 22 -FT-fighters) they have the same icon (vessell?) they travel at the slower speed (battleship speed) they fight as a group.
Production: ie: a  BB  costs 12PP (production points) \ a CR costs 8PP \ a FT costs 1PP
a planet producing up to 7 will produce ONLY FT,
upgrading the planet at 8PP it will produce every turn 1CR for 8PP
upgrading the planet at 11PP it will produce every turn 1CR for 8PP and 3FT for 1PP each
Upgrading the planet at 21PP it will produce every turn 1BB 1CR 3FT
Rules iside the production: a planet producing 24PP is obliged to built 2BB and so on for CR and FT, so if a player wont to build only fighters he cannot upgrade his planet more than 7, for CR no more than 11 and so on. The icon of the group will show the total strenght of the ships inside. If more groups will meet in a planet the will become a single group, never splittable :-(       -Yes it is a limit-

So: Only an icon for a group even a FT is a group of 1 , only the same rally points-

OK for this : There are alternative designs, like just telling the computer how much "strength" to leave behind (where fighters have strength 1, a cruiser has strength 5 or whatever, etc.) and then either hard-coding a preference for leaving behind "big" ships or "small" ships or alternatively have a setting on each planet so the player can choose.


My two cents for Mayhem

Fabio


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